Editor’s Note: The original image included with this story was of bicyclists on a bike lane alongside a street. This was updated to be one of pedestrians which is more in step with the content of the article.
I live close to N 45th so I don’t walk very often across N 40th or N 50th. I cross only when I’m taking the 26 bus or when I’m walking down to Gasworks or up to Green Lake. People I know who live on either side of 40th or 50th say they usually have a hard time crossing the street.
Parents drive their kids to school rather than walking with them, and people often drive really short distances to go shopping or visit friends. 40th and 50th may as well be raging rivers that only the fit, the young or the brave can cross with confidence. These are streets with houses. Places people live. These streets don’t need to be fast-moving car funnels. We have a choice.
And now you have a chance to make your choice happen on the ground.
Starting as soon as 2019, the Seattle Department of Transportation (SDOT) will repave several streets in the Green Lake and Wallingford communities. Fortunately, these days, SDOT now sees repaving major arterials as an opportunity to shift course and design for people, rather than just people in cars who want to use our public right-of-way. This month is an opportunity for you, people who live, work, play, drive, bike, walk, and take the bus on these streets to help SDOT envision how your streets can work best for your active lives.
Here are some questions you might ask:
- Where would you like to be able to safely cross your neighborhood arterial street?
- Are any signals, rapid flashing beacons, or crosswalks planned during the repaving project? (Often SDOT won’t warrant a signal or crosswalk on a busy street because too few people cross that street. To me that is like saying you need to justify a bridge by the number of people who are forced to swim across a river.
- Are any plans being made to accommodate people riding bikes on these repaved streets?
- How fast would you like people in cars to go? (Seattle Council just passed 25 MPH arterial speed legislation but many of the streets to be repaved are currently signed at higher speeds).
- How does SDOT plan to engineer control speeds for public safety?
Repaving is planned here:
- N 40th St: Stone Way N to Latona Ave NE
- N 50th St: Phinney Ave N to Roosevelt Way NE
- Stone Way N: N 45th St to N 50th St
- E Green Lake Way N/E Green Lake Dr N: N 50th to Densmore Ave N
- Green Lake Dr N: Densmore Ave N to Aurora Ave N
- N 80th St: Aurora Ave N to I-5 overpass
Attend an SDOT open house on Wednesday May 24 5:30 to 7PM at Green Lake Elementary (2400 N 65th) to learn more about the project and share your thoughts about getting around your neighborhood. Can’t make the open house? Share your ideas on an online SDOT survey, open May 23 to June 12.
A little more on walking in Wallingford
Marked crosswalks on two or three-lane arterials seem like a very small thing that will go a long way towards making our streets more pleasant places to live and to walk.
Surveys by AARP show over 50% of the people interviewed over age 50 said they couldn’t safely cross the main street closest to them. Their fear is justified. Americans are 16 times more likely to be killed crossing the street than by a natural disaster — and the risks are far higher for older people (citation).
We all benefit from a more walkable bike-able community. Our health improves dramatically, as does air quality and general quality of life. We need to step back and question how our largest public space, our streets, is being used in our neighborhoods. A change in traffic speeds in Wallingford and Green Lake will make a world of difference to people living on these streets and people near those streets who use them daily.
This is probably a good place as any to ask if there are neighbors out there who’d like to revitalize a safe streets organization for Wallingford. I’m the director of Seattle Neighborhood Greenways, a street safety coalition made up of groups around the city advocating for safer walking and biking options. @SNGreenways was the lead group in getting 20 MPH legislation passed last year and we’ve successfully advocated for crosswalks, protected bike lanes, sidewalks, signals, safe routes to school and more. In the past five years we’ve influenced about $40 million in safety spending in Seattle.
I don’t manage Wallingford Greenways since I’m just one of three full-time staff managing our large citywide organization. Folks in Wallingford need to start talking and planning now about a safer, more pleasant way to walk to light rail opening in 2021, as well as talk about slowing traffic to survivable speeds on our major arterials. Anyone interested, join SNG and ping me. Or better still just call a meeting. Be sure to let me know if you do hold a face to face meeting to start planning of how you’d like to see your neighborhood become a more pleasant place for families, for people of all ages to live.
Why stop with 50th? Let’s just convert I-5 into a giant bike lane and call it good. Think of how much healthier we’d all be!
It is really unfortunate that the photo Wallyhood chose to use to illustrate my letter about a Walkable Wallingford is a photo of a bike lane — when all I wrote about was how hard it is for people (especially older people and kids) to walk across our major arterial streets. Please re-read my letter — and please do try to have some compassion for people who walk and bike.
And I’ll talk to Wallyhood about replacing that photo.
Kathy, you mentioned biking and bike lanes at multiple points in your article, so I think it’s understandable why Wallyhood posted that picture.
And just so you know, I fully support having more those hand activated pedestrian flashing lights like the ones you see on Stone Way. Unlike the crosswalk signs and orange flags, they are an effective and inexpensive way to improve pedestrian safety without needlessly slowing down traffic. I urged mayor Murray to install more of them on Stone Way when he came here for the “find it fix it” walk, and I think it makes sense to have them on a couple of places on 50th as well.
However, I strongly object to your misguided policy of deliberately slowing down traffic. 50th and 80th are the two most heavily use crosstown arterials in the entire north end. So you want to make tens of thousands of people who live in places like Magnolia, Ballard, Crown Hill and Fremont endure even longer and more hellish commutes between their homes and I-5? You’re going to see traffic jams all the way back to Phinney Ave if this scheme of yours happens. People will have even less time to spend with their families, and their cars will be spewing even more pollution as they idle there watching the light cycle again and again.
Are you so divorced from reality that you won’t even consider what all these drivers will do when they get fed up with the insane traffic jams? They’re going to divert onto side streets like mine on 48th and my friends and neighbors on 49th or on 51st.
Of course, despite being 2.9% of the commuting public, the bike activists will probably get their way on this because mayor Murray installed a corrupt bike lobbyist (Scott Kubly) as the head of SDOT.
You do realize the things you support also delay the commute for people in Ballard. Cars stopping for pedestrians would be way more disruptive for commutes.
OK, class: We have X number of cars trying to commute from Ballard to I-5. Which option gets them there faster?
A) One lane
B) Two lanes
And TJ, you do realize that cars have to stop for pedestrians regardless, right? The reason why car/pedestrian incidents is because drivers don’t always see people when they step out into a crosswalk, especially when it’s dark and rainy. They do, however, see those flashing hand-activated lights, which is why I believe we should install them everywhere, including on 50th.
Cars having to stop for pedestrians isn’t a thing on 50th. You can go try to cross 50th at unmarked crossings and you’ll see. Cars often zip by too fast to realize somebody is trying to cross. So typically pedestrians have to walk a few blocks to specific crossing areas, which effectively reduce the time cars would have to wait for pedestrians.
“Cars often zip by too fast to realize somebody is trying to cross. ”
Agreed, which, again, is why I support the flashing lights. I’d say Woodlawn and especially 1sr Ave. would be good spots for them, even though it would slow down traffic somewhat.
TJ, twenty three thousand, five hundred cars commute on that stretch of 50th every day, and that doesn’t factor in carpoolers. Meanwhile, 7 people bike it. That’s right, SEVEN. That’s according to SDOT’s own data.
So after reminding them of that fact, I’m happy to report that I just confirmed with SDOT that they are NOT going to kowtow to a noisy minority of activists and put bike lanes on 50th from Stone Way into the U-district. They’re going to leave it as is. Apparently even SDOT can occasionally recognize transportation insanity when they see it.
I think you misunderstood my arguments. I am not arguing for bikes. I am arguing for a slower 50th, so it’s better for pedestrians. And slower 50th could have limited impact on commute, if you know how slow the commute already is.
The opposite of that is on Northlake near Gasworks, where the cars are often very slow, and would see pedestrians clearly and yield. Same as the 45th and Burke: if cars are forced to be slow enough, drivers yield naturally.
Thank you for this. Its great to get reminders on how we can plug in and engage in neighborhood planning and safety. Covering the sidewalks on 50th (and 45th) over I-5 to make them pleasant pedestrian pathways is something I’ve heard mentioned and is an idea I like. I also just wish that speed limits were enforced on 50th and on 51st (and probably lots of other cut through zones) which drivers use as a cut through. I never see SPD giving speeding tix. I think people are stressed and they lose sight of the fact that they are traveling through neighborhoods and if there’s no enforcement, it just persists.
And this is actually where ideas like bike lane or other structural changes would help. The goal obviously is to have traffic slow down as opposed to fining people. To do that, structural changes that forces slow downs would be much more useful than tickets. Making sidewalks wider and roads narrower would be one idea that could work for both 40th and 50th.
Cathy, I feel like we’re living in two different Wallingfords. The hood seems pedestrian-friendly to me. I’m out walking every day, and I’m not alone — lots of kids walk to and from school, and many of the shoppers and diners on 45th are on foot. The nature of the residential streets — mainly one lane for two-way traffic — pretty much forces cars to drive at slow, safe speeds. I’m not often down on 40th, but I frequently cross 50th. If you go to one of the intersections with a stop light you can cross easily — it’s hardly a “raging river that only the fit, the young or the brave can cross with confidence.”
For me, walkability is one of Wallingford’s greatest virtues.
I agree with you Matthew. I live in the heart of Wallingford and have a WalkScore of close to 100 and I too feel blessed to live close to 45th and neighborhood streets where I walk daily. I’m lucky!
Living on, or daily crossing 40th, 50th, Stone, and Green Lake Way is another experience entirely. Old folks and children can’t easily travel to a marked crossing on these streets because they are often a quarter mile apart. I’d love to hear from people who live along these fast-moving streets about their daily experiences and how upgrading their streets to a slower, survivable speed limits would benefit their WalkScores as well.
How would you suggest improving things on 50th? From I-5 to Stone there are currently six lights with pedestrian crossings — you’re never more than two blocks from one of them. That’s not perfect, but I think it’s a reasonable compromise between the needs of pedestrians and drivers.
On 50th, stop bars leading up to marked crosswalks to clarify where people driving should stop (often people driving will roll into crosswalks even on red lights). https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/626ddacecda134028e7b7c5eedba82f713330c9a1a8df17ae1c4db58b8df89d9.png
Post speeds to 25MPH, currently 30MPH.
Different solutions may be needed to make walking safer and more pleasant on Green Lake, Stone, 40th. Curious to hear from people who live on these streets.
As someone who lives south of 40th., crossing 40th is tough and there aren’t nearly the number of controlled opportunities to cross as there is on 50th. There is the stop sign down by Latona and the lights at Wallingford and Stone. Other than that it is at your own risk. I know they are going to be making some changes at Bagley this summer so hopefully that will help some but something does need to change down here. Cars fly on 40th and there has been several pedestrians hit this year trying to cross 40th and there are several somewhat blind spots where drivers have a hard time seeing pedestrians until the last second if they are going too fast. Given the two (or is it 3, is something still @ Lincoln) SPS schools down here it would be great to have it be safer for the kids.
Thanks for this post. In my experience, walking -between- 50th and 40th is quite pleasant and feels safe. Crossing 40th feels less so, and 50th is terrible: I run from south of 50th northward and have to be cautious about how many ******** will run the light (the light no less, not an unsignalized intersection) at 10 or 20 MPH over the speed limit (or more). 50th would benefit from a ton of traffic calming to lower speeds at the times it is not backed up.
Bryan, my guess is you won’t be happy until the entire city grinds to a halt so as to allow your stately progress in jogging shoes.
That comment is entirely out of order. The law is that every single corner is a legal crosswalk and all drivers, without exception except where there is a light, have to yield to pedestrians seeking to cross the street. If you think that slows down traffic, go live in the suburbs where there aren’t short blocks. And if you’re going 40 down 40th Street, as so many cars that don’t stop for pedestrians seem to do, you’re breaking two laws at once. Get over yourself.
Keep yer wig on. I thought it was funny.
I’m back, after a brief technical difficulty with discuss 😉 Too bad I can’t restore my previous posts
I was thinking 20MPH speed limits so humans are dramatically likely not to be killed won’t be killed, but whatevs.
It’s not quite true that there’s a crossing every two blocks, and even if it were, it would mean pedestrians would have to go four blocks out of their way to walk across at 50′ road. 50th has about half as many N/S crossings as 45th, since many of the streets don’t go through. It’s really more like one crossing every four “standard” blocks, forcing people to deviate up to eight blocks to walk 50′, just to convenience people who are sitting on their butts.
Most of the time, there are nice drivers that would stop for pedestrians, if the traffic is slow enough so they can see the pedestrians clearly AND stop comfortably in time. 40th and 50th are hardest to cross not when it’s busiest, but when it’s just somewhat busy and cars just zip by.
Cars stop for pedestrians on Northlake next to Gasworks all the time without lights, because cars are slow due to the road not being straight, and the pedestrians are typically very visible.
I don’t cross N 40th every day, more like once or twice a week. It can be very busy, but it seems to me that if I can afford to wait a bit, eventually there’s a break where I can walk across at a fairly leisurely pace. That’s measurable, in principle – for a given crossing time, how long between breaks at various times of day.
I am lucky enough to live near the Latona/Thackeray crossing of 50th, but it is a long, lonely uphill walk to Sunnyside/Keystone to the next pseudo-crossing. I say “pseudo-” because waiting for that light to change can be an excruciatingly long wait. And when it does, you’re likely to be creamed by someone pulling out of Sunnyside, since it isn’t an actual 4-way light; just a red light for 50th (a really stupid design, IMO).
Fortunately, there is a solution, since there is a park on the southside and a mini-park on the north side – build a pedestrian overpass. Thus, the thru-traffic on 50th is not impeded.
This would also free up a crosswalk to put one down on 1st Ave, which is definitely needed.
Pedestrian overpasses will not save us. Car tunnels will not save us. 5% more car capacity won’t save us. Cars take up so much room per-person on the roads, and when they get where they’re going, you have to allocate just as much room to park them.
Provide well-designed crossings everywhere so that someone living North of 50th will find it safe and more convenient to walk or bike to QFC than it would be to drive, and people will do it. Increased people capacity, increased safety, without turning Seattle into a Chutes & Ladders board.
Jeff, I am not addressing drivers from north of 50th. I’m addressing the fact that 50th is the only direct route to points west (i.e. Fremont, Ballard, etc.) from I-5 and points east. It makes total sense to provide for through traffic to move along relatively unimpeded.
I’m also not saying any of these things will “save” us. I am saying that a pedestrian overpass at Meridian Park would make walking and biking more convenient, which is what you are also advocating.
I suppose this thread is as appropriate as any other to announce that Marie of Romania, after 13 years in residence, has left Wallingford. We have moved (and I use the royal we, of course) to another neighborhood. Because we are no longer living in your lovely community (and it is a special, wonderful place), we feel it is only fair to limit our posts to an occasional thought or, of course, correcting cathywonderful’s spelling (which we declare to be one of The Seven Wonders of Wallingford, but we digress…).
All that said (and it was a lot, wasn’t it?), we moved from a house directly on 50th Street and possess many thoughts about life in that place. We will share them in no particular order:
* It was awfully nice having the 50th Street Deli open because it meant we did not have to cross 50th to 7-11. It also meant we had homeless people passed out on the weekly in our yard, but damned it it wasn’t nice not to have to die to get a can of black olives. Once the deli closed, we learned quickly the perils and tedium of waiting to cross, and then actually crossing, 50th Street.
* With so much commerce at that corner (the closed deli is going to be replaced with a building that has a commercial space and maybe the commercial space next door to it will activate someday) it seems only right to have a disco light crosswalk, with signs that flash like Studio 54 on a hot Saturday night in the 70s. We use one of these near our new house and they afford great comfort across a very busy 4-lane-wide arterial. They need one at 50th and 1st Ave NE and they need it now.
* At the same time, now is not the time to girdle the flow of traffic on 50th beyond installing a crosswalk or two. As one of the more useful E-W arterials, it’s important to the beating heart of our current traffic. When light rail arrives in 2021 (cough cough) and more buses are running then sure, start to think about bike lanes, etc., but for now we need the flow capacity. In fact, we think no parking at all on 50th from I-5 to Green Lake Way is just fine.
* Finally, we would like to thank the people of Wallingford for keeping a very nice neighborhood. We know growth is hard and change will come, but we also hope that 45th stays 45th, that amazing restaurants and community spaces open from 50th down to the lake on Stone Way, and that we figure out a way to put the campers at the off- and on-ramps into homes that they see as homes, and in which they stay for happier lives. We wish you peace.
Marie of Romania
Aw, I’m sad to see you go Marie! I hope a nice family bought your house, instead of some developer who will just slap up some ugly boxes and put some bold paint colors on them and call it “architecture.” And I completely agree we should install those flashing crosswalk lights at 1st and 50th.
Thank you, Hayduke. The house remains in its original state.
How kind people are.
I miss you, Marie if Romania.
,,,
“awfully nice”…. I hope you enjoy your new place and find a ‘name” for yourself in whateve3r local news offering ther eis in your new area. Maybe even a better use of your time may evolve.
Wallingford is stuck between Freemont/Ballard and I-5. We obviously cannot, and should not, block or restrict the free flow of people about their daily business. People need to get onto or up from I-5 during commutes, and the ramp restrictions are meant to slow traffic onto the highway. The result is massive backups onto 45th and 50th that drive people to zoom in between in the faint hope that the other arterial is moving faster. My street, 4th between 45th and 50th, and especially Latona, are down right raceways at times.
50th was re-designed a decade or so ago to speed traffic off of I-5 and heading west, but the cost was a to have only a single lane east until about Latona. I, too, lived on 50th, likely near Her Highness, late of Wallingford, and the fun of backing out of my driveway into rush our traffic is best left in my nightmares.
45th, well, as a commercial strip, with highly restricted neighborhood parking around it, needs street parking to support the businesses. We need look only at the damage to businesses on Roosevelt Way NE, where a re-pacing project turned out to be removal of all parking on the west side of the street from 50th to 65th so a very small handful of bicyclists can have a private speedway.
My suggestions, then, are to remove the confusing crosswalk light at 45th and Sunnyside and replace it with the “disco” lights; I’d even wear a white Travolta suit to its dedication. Add similar lights along 50th, in particularly at 1st. As for 40th, a speed indicator would help on the slope going east from Wallingford Ave. near the Durn Good Grocery. I hear tell they actually do have a slowing effect. Add some “discos,” especially at Sunnyside (that pesky street again), and the occasional very visible police presence, no hiding just to get revenue, and people would take it slower.
Beyond that, crossing flags as described here https://sites.google.com/site/crossingflags/home (thanks to a thread on Next Door about this), and that old common sense we were taught as kids – look both ways before you cross. Especially for bicyclists; many of them seem to think they are exempt from traffic regs.
We should allow “free flow” of through traffic, but not to the extent that it would either compromise safety for any road user or divide our neighborhood.
I’m curious how people who live in Wallingford and Green Lake feel about posting 25MPH on the arterials about to be repaved? https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/bc306cb2fef434ea36e32a7f95341917f9259e4230ef238ea65517eca8006c2a.png
There is extensive evidence that slowing speeds to 20 or 25 MPH saves lives.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/1e7300eacbfc3d37543844399f7c7ec859243affa9628fcc1649a57d3211f92b.jpg
No worries, won’t change a thing.
Exactly. People don’t obey speed limits, they drive at the sped they feel comfortable with for the conditions. Furthermore, the cops can’t even be bothered to deal with the rampant property crime that’s skyrocketed with the growth of homelessness here, what makes anyone think they’ll start enforcing speed limits?
The sensible, effective, and much more economic way to improve pedestrian safety is to install the hand-activated pedestrian lights, especially at heavily used crossings. Pedestrian right-of-way at crosswalks law doesn’t do you any good if the driver can’t see you.
Changing speed limit signs to 25 MPH is step #1 to engineering and enforcing safer, more livable speeds.
Photo below of new speed limit sign on NE 665th near Roosevelt Ave NE.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/8c010eccde641d2244de9468e4f2377d81023f0beea754f7bb1aff6c3b5c4f52.jpg
I tend towards 30 MPH to keep traffic moving and towards 25 MPH for consistency with the city-wide arterial speed limit. Either way it needs to be posted to make the limit clear.
It must be emphasized that posting the speed limit does very little for safety. The evidence is very clear that safety and harm reduction is the result of traffic-calming streets, and does not happen when the speed limit changes.
The challenge is to have traffic calming devices that cause drivers to drive at or under the design speed. Devices that work well are:
– Streets perceived as narrow. Drivers naturally set their speed by the perceived width of the street.
– Horizontal diversion. Such as traffic circles and chicanes.
– Curb bulbs. Make the street feel narrower; prevent vehicles parking too close to the corner; and provide high visibility for pedestrians (and vehicles) ready to cross.
– Rotaries. Proper rotaries move more traffic than signal or stop sign intersections while providing high-visibility and right-of-way to pedestrians and cyclists.
If SDOT can commit to fix 65th (and we’ll see if they actually do[1]), then why not 50th? It should be even simpler since there is no bus service. 50th has 25k daily vehicles, which is at the high end for a 4->3 road diet, but not unreasonable (about comparable to 75th).
Whenever I try to cross 50th, I feel like I’m taking my life in my own hands – people frequently swerve around drivers following the law and stopping for pedestrians. I’ve even been yelled/cursed at for crossing at legal crosswalks.
[1] https://www.theurbanist.org/2017/05/19/ne-65th-street-vision-zero-concepts-unveiled/
I thought much of 50th had already been dieted. During rush hour it feels like maybe all it gets to eat is a crust of bread and some warm water. Surely the diet has reached its limit?
No, it’s 4 lanes most of the way between Stone Way and Phinney. It gets funny in places with a center turn lane, but you still have two through-lanes on at least one side. A standard 4->3 diet has one through lane on each side, and then a center turn lane. Road diets don’t always reduce capacity since you have much more consistent movements – no more swerving around people trying to make a left turn – and certainly are more pleasant for people not encased in an armored shell and air bags.
I think that may have been a joke, about the use of “diet” for a street that isn’t getting the nourishment it needs anyway. We’ve talked before here about traffic diverting from 50th to side streets.
@Donn – I think these folks believe that cars will magically go away because all the drivers will be frustrated by insanely long commutes and instead board the many mass transit options we have. Ooops, sorry…we don’t have those in anything like the numbers needed to handle the traffic on 50th Street. But no matter – 78% of Urbanism is magic, in case you didn’t know.
Like the great things that the density fairy has up her sleeve, to bestow on us someday when the developers have really had their fill?
LOL, “density fairy,”love it! Looks like she’s been very busy, Seattle absolutely crushes other cities with regards to recent density increases:
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/22/upshot/seattle-climbs-but-austin-sprawls-the-myth-of-the-return-to-cities.html?_r=0
Thanks for reminding us that we can use repaving as an opportunity to fix crosswalks and bike lanes.
Although each arterial poses unique problems for cars, bike and pedestrians, a lower speed limit will improve safety for everyone. While they’re at it, it would be nice to raise the storm drain grates flush with the pavement so they don’t grab bike tires.
At peak times, car commuters can only wish they could hit 20 mph between Ballard and the freeway. I don’t think it’s a good deal for Wallingford to risk the lives of school children and seniors for a 30 second reduction in travel time for folks simply passing through our neighborhood.
Biking daily from Greenlake to Fremont, takes about 12-15 mins. When forced to drive, it’s often 15-20 mins.with traffic backed up for 2 signal changes at 45th and 50th. Faster speeds will not create a more efficient traffic flow at peak volumes. Traffic lights and intersections are jammed with cars, not bikes and pedestrians. Impatient drivers trying to avoid over-crowed arterials make each unmarked intersection more dangerous for other cars, bike and pedestrians.
Seattle’s surface streets are past peak capacity. I’ve found that the only way to improve travel in the city is to reduce traffic by taking transit, riding bikes and walking.