The project proposing to prevent Tangletown cut throughs by blocking easy I-5 access from Tangletown received 90 comments, more than all the other NPSF projects put together. Justin wrote the following, which seemed to encapsulate the general tone of many of the comments:
I live on NE 51st St at the corner of 5th NE, literally 50 feet from the proposed barriers. Yes, plenty of traffic “cheats” and cuts through the neighborhood rather than sit through the snarl that is the 50th St on/off ramps during rush hour. There is a pretty constant stream of cars past my house in the morning and afternoon. While a little bothersome, I don’t really see this as a problem. The biggest problem is those cars that are jumping over or going around the short curb from the southbound I-5 off ramp and cutting up our street to get around the light. This is especially bad in the summer, when westbound 50th backs up from the interstate to the zoo. The problem is that our little street is only wide enough for one car to pass, and when that uphill traffic meets the downhill traffic there is nowhere to go. I would really love for a proper barrier to be put up to force traffic exiting the interstate through to the light, but the second barrier that prevents me from accessing eastbound 50th street and both of the freeway on-ramps without battling downhill traffic to go around the light at Latona would be ridiculous for the PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY LIVE HERE. I think it’s cute that folks who live in Tangletown would happily inconvenience the home owners closer to the freeway to limit traffic in their stretch of the neighborhood.
So how about doing the limited change that Justin suggests? The change is small enough that it should not require a traffic study or a supplemental funding source- it just amounts to dropping some concrete barriers down, which SDOT does all the time for safety and construction. Here are some pretty pictures to illustrate the idea:
So, if you like the idea or don’t, please comment. If commenters here generally endorse the idea then I’ll take it to SDOT and see what happens!
Seems reasonable to me!
I concur with the limited change proposal (Thanks, Justin, for taking the time to articulate this so well).
Well-stated — seems like the results of the change would be clear-cut and useful (and, as Kate says, limited.) Thank you!
A high-ish planter strip with a couple of bushes would achieve the same result and be less ugly.
Potentially less ugly, depending mainly on maintenance.
Perfectly reasonable since turning there would be a violation anyhow. However, I do wonder if some scofflaws would try to drive around it.
Make it long enough to dissuade adventurists and I’d hazard that an overgrown and unkempt median strip is still prettier than a concrete bollard.
In view of the blackberry patch immediately to the north, I think I like the jersey barrier better. At least they don’t collect trash as much. But neither is much of an asset. I guess in a freeway context like this, we can’t expect much, but a few boulders might do the trick and look a bit better. Or something. I wonder if they could recycle telephone poles for stuff like this?
Seems good to me. Not being able to drive over curbs takes away another stupid reason to buy an SUV…
Something slightly more attractive would be nice, but I think, given that it’s right next to I-5, it’d be like adding a glass of fine wine to a 55-gallon drum of sewage. Not really an improvement, aesthetically.
I support this idea.
No. Getting from the off-ramp into the right lane to make the turn on busy days is daunting enough, without adding obstacles and effectively shortening the lane.
Agree with Fruitbat (comment 11) that this will create (more) problems for drivers heading south on NE 5th and from I-5 offramp attempting to legally turn right west up NE 50th. I thought the primary concern of the original project was to prevent drivers AND their motor vehicles from heading east through the northern reaches of Wallyhood (Tangletown). Now we’re focused on a limited population of curb jumpers – it’s a whole new project and not one I’ll support. I’ve lived on NE 51st for 35 years and like its access to NE 5th and the I-5 on ramp.
I agree with Fruitbat. The depiction of the new barrier is longer than the curb. The curb seems long enough to prevent a turn West onto 51st. Making the curb too high to drive over seems like that should be enough. People have to merge going south on 5th NE and it is already pretty tight.
This is the best solution to a problem
I have read to date!
It’s starting to feel that this issue is a personal issue for Eric that is best championed as a personal (or localized neighborhood area issue) than it is for the Wallingford community. The tone I heard in the 90 comments wasn’t nearly as much like Justin’s comment as it was “this isn’t a critical problem for the community.” Having Eric pick it back up seems like a slight mis-use of the blog editor role. Fine if Eric or Justin want to contact SDOT to see what’s possible but be careful about messaging that the Wallingford COMMUNITY supports it simply because people have commented on the blog.
Scooter: I’m not sure what they would say in journalism school, but it’s fair to say that I’m wearing multiple hats here. I’m the author, the editor, and I’m on the community council. The blog has been hugely helpful in getting community feedback, so I plan to put forward ideas on the blog, not just facts. For instance, the original proposal to cut off I-5 access from 5th Ave N was perceived by those of us on the community council as being something the neighborhood would like as it would cut down on cut through traffic, but the proposal was clearly more contentious than we thought. We also look at page views and comments, and the Tangletown cut through proposal got a lot of attention, so a follow up was warranted on that basis.
In my defense, I have nothing personal to gain from this concrete barrier, and if anyone else wants to float proposals or opinions that are Wallingford centric I’m all for it. Just write the article and I’ll work with you on getting it posted. SDOT generally ignores our neighborhood as we are not near light rail or a major project, like the Mercer reconfiguration or Westlake cycle track. That has traditionally meant that we just get ignored and all the project dollars and attention go elsewhere. Wallyhood can be a channel to have our neighborhood issues get noticed by government.
Hi neighbors!
I agree with 15 Scooter.
I also agree with 11 and 13.
As one who has tried this shortcut when I used to own a truck (frankly, it wasn’t worth it), there is one crumbled section of the curb you have to make in order to cross over in time to hit 51st. Once you reach the end of the curb section, you are past 51st.
If the existing curb is made more daunting, there is no reason to lengthen it.
I sort of like the idea of planting that area – maybe plant trees that don’t require so much maintenance. Yay, carbon sequestration!
Yes, make the existing curb bigger (so people can’t drive over it), but NOT longer.
Thank you Eric for EVERYTHING you do to keep Wallingford a good place to live.
That sounds better than cutting off access to the freeway from 5th. One thing I’m wondering–would adding a taller barrier there cut down on visibility at all? During heavy travel periods, it’s already a little scary to be skooching over one lane to the left on 5th to be lined up to go through the intersection into the onramp queue…right at the same time that exiting vehicles are trying to cut across to the right for going west on 50th. That would be my only concern.
Question: What is the community council, and who are its members? What does the council do? Is there a website?
Thanks.
Okay, I found the website: http://www.wallingfordcc.org/p/about-us.html
“We meet from 7:15 to 8:45 pm the first Wednesday of every month, in room 202 of the Good Shepherd Center. Everyone from the neighborhood is encouraged to attend. Agenda and notes are posted to wallyhood.org each month before the meeting.”
It says everyone is encouraged to attend – I’ve never heard of the council, so I’m not sure they do much to encourage attendance. I’ve never seen an agenda on Wallyhood – where would I find that?
runyararo: The annual meeting next month will get more publicity. The meeting this past Wednesday was really just organizational, without featured speakers. The president of the WCC has not been doing a good job of getting the agenda published early so I haven’t been able to publish it on Wallyhood. I will try to fix that going forward.
@ruynararo: use the “Search Wallyhood” window and type in Wallingford Community Council or WCC to see what the council has been up to in recent years.
YIKES! I agree with the others who talk about VISIBILITY. I have to use my mirrors to see if/when I can move right getting off the ramp, to make the R on 50th. A taller curb, but not a jersey barrier, would be so much safer. (Many vehicles are mirror-dependent.)
Comments here have been great, thanks!
I talked with the city about this change and, while they generally agree with it, they can’t make any changes outside the parameters of existing funds. Safe streets for school require changes within a block of a school, the NPSF fund requires the annual ranking process, and other changes require crash statistics to justify. This change doesn’t fit into a funding bucket so it’s rejected for now.
The only option until next year’s NPSF would be to do a neighborhood matching grant application. It’s a tiny project- estimated cost is only $3000. If anyone wants to champion this going forward let me know by email or adding a comment here. You can have a planter or a shorter barrier or whatever you want, just so long as you convince SDOT and get the funding lined up. This change is nowhere near where I live, so having me push it further doesn’t make a lot of sense.
Hi there neighbors. This is the original Justin who’s comment was copied in the body of this post (not the freeway estates Justin from comment 10!), late to the party for a second time. First I want to say thanks to everyone for such a great discussion, and I apologize if the last sentence of my original post came off as passive-aggressive (or just plain aggressive-aggressive). It had been a rough day. That said… this is EXACTLY the solution I’ve wanted for years. I make that turn every single day, and I understand people’s concerns about visibility. I don’t think the barrier has to be very high, or even longer than the existing curb. Just high enough to dissuade the small percentage of people who make that illegal turn. If people are concerned about merging with freeway exiting traffic, some simple “merge” and “yield” signage would likely do the trick
And just to be clear, I don’t really see this about limiting traffic on my one solitary block so much as mitigating the clog factor for people coming downhill through the neighborhood, which affects everyone in the hood that uses that route. I live on the street and I almost NEVER drive up it…
Hi Justin! You were on the Internet writing a comment, you were supposed to be grumpy. Fortunately I don’t have feelings.
What SDOT suggested was the matching grant process. Since the proposal is only about $3000 and you can match with either time or money, it might be worth your while, or something to chat over with the neighbors. Let me know if you’re interested in moving the idea forward, I can walk you through the process 🙂
You have access to my email from my posts, correct? I would be happy to talk with you about it and see if it’s something I can help with! Drop me a line.