Seattle Schools has announced its “proposed” fee of $2,720 for full-day Kindergarten during the 2012-13 school year. These fees cover the costs for the non-funded portion of a full day of Kindergarten, half of which is covered by the state. Payment can be made in 10 monthly installments of $272 per month, beginning September 1. Checks must be received by the first of each month, or parents have the option to enroll in automatic bank withdrawal, which occurs on the fifth of every month. Click here for more information.
While it “may be” an option to enroll students in half-day Kindergarten in some schools (I put that in quotes since it has to be discussed with the school principal first and cleared through the District), children enrolled in the language immersion programs at John Stanford or McDonald must attend full-day Kindergarten.
Here’s another friendly reminder, too, that Open Enrollment begins on February 27 and continues through March 9.
Most of Wallingford is now in the B.F. Day zone. No language immersion there. I wonder how many Wallingford residents are aware of the school’s action of a few weeks ago to basically give itself an enrollment zone that catches an area of Wallingford about the size of the Woodland Park Zoo? Maybe 100-odd homes?
Bottom line, if you have an incoming kindergartener in the next year or two, he or she is probably going to B.F. Day. Happy about that? I’m not and will be happy to provide information to anyone who comments and asks.
Huber, if you plan to provide “information” please try not to be the hyper-local equivalent of Fox News with a private agenda.
First of all, SPS sets the zones, not BF Day, so your vilification of BF Day is wholly unfounded. They didn’t run out in the dead of night and “capture the flag” from an unsuspecting JSIS. The process is a bit more sophisticated than principals’ calling “dibs”. A school’s draw area is based on the number of kids in a certain distance of the school. If you saturate the area closest to the school, you have to pull back the boundaries. That’s what happened. Cause and effect of people trying to buy an education in a public school system.
Secondly, in all of your bitching, have you actually *been* to BF Day and looked around or sat in a classroom? It’s a great school. The teacher my daughter has couldn’t be better. -We simply couldn’t have gotten the education she needs at the other choices. We opted *out* of JSIS to go to Day. -(GASP!)
Lastly, please gather the information on how and why language immersion is a *better* educational experience for your kids. I’ve asked that several times in these forums and not one person has brought forth evidence of how they made this important decision for their kids based on research. Some have cultural reasons which I certainly respect, but the rest of us seem to be guessing and following the trend. Not saying it’s a bad choice, but I’ve yet to see a thoughtful comment on this here about how people decided their kids simply MUST learn in a Japanese or Spanish immersion environment. There are downsides to immersion such as concurrent acquisition of both languages is slower than learning one, math and other science content has to be taught twice during the day, reducing the overall range of content taught by 30%, and there is no research I am aware of that shows immersion kids do better on standardized tests or in college. And it’s actually been disproved that the second language window completely “closes” when you are older. It’s a little harder, to drill in, but can be done. It’s also completely exclusionary of other diversity in the school such as special ed programs, and prevents any kid moving into the area past Kindergarten age from attending their local school
Anyway, I welcome “information” not propaganda and whining about “plans” and property values.
The intent of public education is for *everyone* to get an equal shot at a quality education. We have no birth or land rights to preferential treatment here in Wallingford.
I appreciate your engaging on this topic because my “private agenda” (God forbid anyone should have a “private agenda”!) is what I want made public. You’re helping that effort and I am grateful.
That said, you characterize my post in language more extreme than I used (i.e., “dead of night”?) and seem to conclude some things that I did not even state (my supposed “villification” of B.F. Day). I’m not happy to have to send my child there when JSIS is within easy walking distance and all of her friends are going there and we believe (perhaps without much merit, but still) that language immersion is a valuable thing, but that doesn’t constitute “villification” of B.F. Day. I sense defensiveness on the part of a B.F. Day parent. I understand that and am sorry you took it as such.
And I agree that nobody is ENTITLED to preferential treatment. But I am ENTITLED to try to get it for my daughter, especially if her inability to get it resulted from what I believe to be mismanagement. (That’s what made this country great, blah blah blah.) You, of course, are entitled to ignore these posts.
But more importantly, since you asked for it, here comes the information.
1. The school, and not the school board, drew the western border for JSIS at Corliss Ave. Yes, technically the school board has to approve it, but have you ever seen the school board decline one of these things? They were there to rubber stamp it. For background, see the page below. I also met with Sherry Carr, our School Board rep, and Tracy Libros, on the school board staff, who both confirmed that the PTSA and the school essentially overrode their desire to draw that line at a more natural boundary: Wallingford Ave. The school’s and especially the PTSA’s interests are not those of Wallingford’s, of course. They are of the parents of current JSIS students who will get their siblings into JSIS under this plan. I can’t blame them but where was the pushback? I bet I know. See next bullet point.
http://stanfordes.seattleschools.org/modules/cms/pages.phtml?pageid=258975&sessionid=1277f8856456f63c6a59116eea105ea8&sessionid=1277f8856456f63c6a59116eea105ea8
2. Tracy Libros’s plan to draw the boundary at Wallingford Ave. had been published for several weeks and we assumed it would be the plan to go to the School Board. Then, on Thursday, Jan 12, the JSIS plan drawing the border at Corliss was published. (There were other reductions.) The school board vote was scheduled for the following Wed, Jan 18 and Monday, Jan 16 was a holiday. So for all intents and purposes, the plan had almost no opportunity for PUBLIC review (i.e., outsiide the JSIS PTSA). Not exactly “dead of night”, but not much better.
3. I am interested in your suggestions that language immersion has downsides. Do you have cites for your statements? I have none for my belief that it is a good thing other than the common sense belief that learning languages at any age expands the mind. I have never used the trigonometric integration skills I learned in college, and have long since forgotten them, but my brain is bigger for the effort!
4. Although I understand B.F. Day’s reputation is improving, the polls taken from its parents, etc. seem to indicate it’s a middle-of-the-pack school, whereas JSIS’s scores border on the perfect. I don’t have those figures in front of me but I know some people who do and can get them if you want.
5. The border for the JSIS enrollment zone, unti this year, had practically abutted B.F. Day, which no doubt contributed to the JSIS over-crowding for the last few years? Why did no one do something about it when it was become obvious that the borders were unsustainable? That might have meant a less-onerous border shift.
5. Finally for the facts, and most importantly, I don’t believe it is necessary to draw that border at Corliss as the school believes is necessary. If you study the zone carefully, you see that if you eliminate the student housing to the east of I-5, which even Sherry Carr admitted rarely provides more than one or two incoming kindergarteners each year, hte JSIS zone includes only about 100 homes. Out of that we’re supposed to get about 52 kindergarteners? Either almost every current JSIS student has a sibling entering school this year, or they have done a poor job of it. When I asked Sherry Carr why the zone was so small, she said that historically the Corliss line attracted two kindergaten classes. But that was before the schools got more agressive at declining applications from people who rented apartments in that east-of-I-5 zone.
In the interest of brevity (perhaps too late?), I haven’t even mentioned here my case for the belief that JSIS should be admitting three, and not two, kindergarten classes this year, which would mean a border of about Wallingford Ave.
So, in conclusion, what I (and many others) have formally asked of our school board is that they put “proximity” to school above “lottery” on the list of tie-breakers for enrollment at JSIS. That’s what I’m doing with my anger. If that is not successful and our child (and her younger sister in her turn) has to get bused to an inferior school when she could walk to a superior one, then I will accept our fate and work to make B.F. Day an even better school than JSIS. But until then, I am entitled to petition my government for better treatment and I am entitled to ask for the support of others. Do I have yours? Anyone else?
Sorry, if I took you the wrong way, but you led by mentioning BF Day, then said *the* school’s actions, “their”, etc. , so I assumed you were saying Day somehow decided the boundaries/fates of Wallingford residents in a land grab.
As for how boundaries are set, I don’t think the # of households means very much. It’s the # of households which have kids approaching school age. You can probably pull in almost all of the U-district as you approach the University and not change the impact on JSIS much. Going the other way towards 99, you have a huge impact.
Yes, the area around JSIS is densely packed with families with kids. That explains the property values in that area, right? -And why so many are upset now, thinking that purchase was a lock in to JSIS. I totally believe the boundaries needed to retract that much due to density.
As for the impeccable scores, I had a very lengthy discussion about this in the comments when the scores came out last year, which you can find here on Wallyhood: http://www.wallyhood.org/2010/11/seattle-schools-releases-district-scorecard-school-reports/
But in a nutshell, the diff is almost completely attributable to the diversity of the population. As an option school for the south end, BF Day had a 42% reduced/free lunch population prior to the NSAP, and the low scores parallel that population. JSIS had about 12-17% as I recall with most of their draw coming from the surrounding neighborhood. -Which comprises families that can afford 500k-1M houses. -Which means educated, which means they spend time on homework with their kids because they are actually HOME and not working two jobs, etc.
We won’t know true apples-apples post-NSAP scores until the schools have the same % of neighborhood draw, which won’t be until today’s 1st graders are in 5th.
I do have citations on the studies I mention except for the 30% repeated content. That came directly from me asking JSIS teachers about how they teach math & science in a foreign language, and they told me they repeat 60% of the morning’s content in the afternoon. So 50% of the day x 60% =30% redundancy to accomodate immersion.
I did the research on immersion several years ago when deciding where to send our oldest child, I’ll see if I can dig up the cites and post them here.
You may be able to find them here on Wallyhood if you google “Chris+ annoying+ residents” 🙂
Content at JSIS is NOT repeated in the afternoon. It may occasionally be touched on in the English part of the day to ensure students understand. The immersion side historically teaches math, most science, and some social studies while the English side teaches literacy.
Yes, I see now why you might have assumed I was trying to cast B.F. Day as the villain. I am a product of Florida public schools so my writing could be better? Sorry.
I will be studying your test score posts and other related information. Thanks for posting it.
This is a very complicated story, of course, which is why it’s hard to get across in something like a blog post. And I am aware that “for everyone who gets the benefit of one of these plans, someone feels they are treated unfairly”, which is what everyone at the school board tells me. Fine. But that doesn’t mean I’m going to sit back and take it. Especially when the people who ultimately decided what’s “fair” in this situation are those who stand to benefit most from the plan they proposed. So here are my complaints. If I am wrong, I hope someone will let me know.
– It appears that what the JSIS PTSA wants, it gets. JSIS could fit three kindergarten classes this year with some admitted and regretted losses to some facilities and some other accompdations. In fact, three classes would be a more sustainable plan. After all, what happens next year when you had four language immersion first grade classrooms and now you only need two? Further, Sherry Carr told me that the McDonald people are screaming because they are being forced to take in FIVE kindergarten classes this year, due to a large extent to this plan. Apparently, they just don’t have the pull that JSIS does.
– When my daughters sleep at night, their heads are about six feet from the JSIS boundary. Meanwhile, people who live within a stone’s throw of B.F. Day, some half-a-mile to the west of us, will be sending their third sibling past my daughters on the way to JSIS every morning. (Hence, our appeal for “proximity” as a tie-breaker.) But who let this happen in the first place and why do we continue to have confidence they can manage it in the future?
– In a few years, when the overcrowding at JSIS is presumably eased, the JSIS boundaries will no doubt be moved out, perhaps even to their old places. So that means my daughters will be bused to B.F. Day while people who live way to the west of us will be going to JSIS again. Neighborhood schools? My sweet aunt.
In the grand scheme of things, this is not a huge injustice. I believe, as you do, that parents are by FAR the greater factor in a child getting a good education and that our daughters will be fine no matter where they go. I am also encouraged by your deeper research into B.F. Day’s emerging reputation. (After all, there are lies, damn lies and statistics, right?) But, sad to say, nothing seems to get done around here without a lot of screaming (and a lot of unnecessary public referenda, but that’s another story), so I want to be sure the actions of JSIS and the school board are well-publicized. If Wallingford residents are fine with losing their neighborhood school, the one we have supported financially and in other ways for many years, so be it.
I’d be interested in hearing other perspectives on this.
My perspective is that it’s rather unfair that families who live in the McDonald or JSIS areas have to pay full-day K tuition with no option of half-day unless they opt into a school that’s further away from their home. That seems a little unjust to me, and not at all in keeping with the spirit of “public” school.
And I am continually frustrated by this new notion that kids can ONLY learn a foreign language in an immersion setting starting at a very young age or else they’re going to be locked out and left behind forever. I really believe that’s what’s driving all this Must Have Language Immersion panic, and it’s so unfortunate.
While it’s true that the younger they are, the easier it is to pick up a new language, it’s also true that things don’t freeze up in the brain until early adulthood. There’s plenty of time. And even if there isn’t…suppose they don’t get an opportunity to learn Spanish until junior high or high school and they have to work a lot harder to “get” it. Is that such a bad thing? There’s a lot of value in working hard to learn something new, isn’t there? I know people who didn’t start learning French or Spanish until high school who are now fluent. It’s possible. And while foreign language fluency may impress those college admissions folks, that alone is not going to be your kid’s golden ticket in. Think outside the box a little. There’s more than one way to provide your child with an excellent education.
Meanwhile, my son is getting a great education at B.F. Day. They have an advanced learning program. Stanford and McDonald don’t. They’re learning chess as part of the regular school day, not just in chess club. Math, library, art, and P.E. are all excellent. There is a Spanish class too. It’s not immersion, but it’s better than nothing.
Look, the school district screws families around. It’s what they do. Have you talked to any of the Lowell@Lincoln families who don’t even have a BUILDING anymore? Or special ed families who get moved from school to school every year as the district cuts our services? You could do a lot worse than B.F. Day, people. Time to start whipping up a batch of delicious lemonade.
To Floor Pie, have you ever taught a second language to middle school or junior high students? The general collective thought framework is that its too hard. Mind you, I said ‘general”.
While this may nto be true, collective group think impacts ones ability to learn. The immersion programs provide a very strong base for a language as well as other language learning. Immersion means that one is ‘on point’ sotospeak to learn the language or one may miss something. Parents who value second language learnign fo many reasons make choices and attempt to enroll their students in programs which reflect their ideas and thoughts about what will benefit their children.
Ther eis a lot of discussion as well as controversy over how to administer Immersion and Dual Language Programs.. look into Dual Language and see what you think abou tthat!
I don’t know what to tell you ABC123, I got that 60%-morning-repeat answer from a JSIS teacher at the open house at the other JS center a few years ago, with 3 other JSIS teachers standing right behind her smiling and nodding in agreement. It wasn’t until I restated it as, “So that’s 30% less content in exchange for a 2nd language?”, that they were left looking at each other w/o a response. It seems quite plausible to me that reviewing again in English would be necessary if you are trying to teach the looping Everyday Math curriculum in an immersion setting.
(Going to resist urge to rant about Everyday Math and standardized test misalignment and enjoy my Sunday now…)
locoloco, I did teach 8th grade once upon a time, but not a foreign language. Those kids were super-sharp, though. I don’t doubt they could have done the work.
I took Spanish and German starting in 7th grade at a rural public middle school. Easily my favorite classes, and I know my friends felt the same way. I can’t speak for my entire class or for the teacher’s experience, but she seemed to love her job and it seemed like the majority of us went on to study either language in high school and even college. (I blew it by trying to take Italian in college instead of pursuing Spanish any further, but that’s another story.)
That’s an interesting perspective though. “Too hard.” Could it be that all this panic over elementary school immersion is just more helicopter parenting? Trying to protect our kids from something that’s “too hard”? I wonder…
well, Chris, it’s nto really 30% less.. much is picked up from the second language especially after a few months.
In Dual Language model, ther eis no review of the content but native Spanish speakers and native English speakers get their math in English and Social Studies in spanish. Reading is in the native language.
All good stuff. Can anyone who reads this do me and perhaps others in Wallingford a favor? Write an email to Tracy Libros ([email protected]) and Sherry Carr ([email protected]) and ask them to put “proximity to school” ahead of “lottery” in tie-breaks for entrance to JSIS for the 2012-2013 transition plan.
If they can’t fill up two kindergarten classrooms with the dinky enrollment area or they decide to go to three kindergarten classrooms this year, Wallingford residents will have dibs on those seats. You got to admit, that’s reasonably fair.
Appreciate your help.